Rocky IV - Really not much more than some montages strung together

Wockenfuss · Guru

RE: Rocky IV - Really not much more than some montages strung together

pocaroba · Guru

Wow. That surgery photo was kind of unnecessary, huh? I think we all know about my feelings for 'Gitte, pre or post surgery. That is all I will say.

Are you looking for more 'Gitte information? Check out this article I wrote for my college newspaper so many years ago:

http://www.dailyvanguard.com/home/index.cfm?event=displayArticlePrinterFriendly&uStory_id=c0df8cb6-f922-4dae-8d79-cc705fe8e1e0

Wockenfuss · Guru

This thread got jacked! I'm slipping.

Back to something related to Rocky IV: Have you guys seen Brigitte Nielsen post-recent surgery?

She's back, baby!

Awkward boob shot in the photo slideshow here.

pocaroba · Guru

Did you "achieve" when you saw Jerry Rice in person? I would probably start crying if I ever saw Dale Murphy. I figure that is a fair comparison.

Drainiac · Member

I get them all at my hotel I work at in downtown Portland. Cassell was a funny old bastard.

This last weekend, I met Jerry Rice who was in town for god-know-why. Didn't get to say much to him, just a Seinfeldesque "Helllllooooooooooooo".

But, the next day, and I know this is gonna make you super jealous.....the Kids in the Hall cast stayed at our hotel. I met all of them but spent the most time talking to Dave "Call me Dave" Foley and Mark McKinney. They were in Portland doing a live comedy show. Super nice guys, really. Also, in my limited time talking to and helping them, they definitely made their off-kilter sense of humor evident to our other guests. Very funny stuff.

Anyways, that is how I meet these people. It's not like a Drain has connects or anything? ****....and Rocky Balboa was freakin dumb.

pocaroba · Guru

Tim Robbins is an all-time stallion. The man who starred in "Jacob's Ladder" can do no wrong by me. Except for "Code 46" but that is another story. And Susan Sarandon is one fine piece of ayce.

Seymore Cassel is awesome. How in the hey did you run into these people? (Oh and by the way you are completely wrong about "Rocky Balboa," which is an incredibly awesome movie. So there).

icyhot · Senior Member

Don`t try to name drop looser. btw, I hate susan surandon and tim robbins. She was horrable on the last season of rescue me.

Drainiac · Member

The new Rocky movie was super dumb. And I dont mean that in a "Mac Dre" way where super dumb is actually a good thing. It ****in sucked. Sly is so damn old. Stop making Rocky movies. Let it be.

In a completely unrelated story: I met Tim Robbins and Susan Sarandon when they were in Portland. Had some drinks with Timmy, he's a cool dude, super funny too. I also just met Seymore Cassell two days ago. I know the CAC would know who that is with the breadth of their extensive cinematic knowledge. Dude is a riot. Bitter and old are two attributes that can really birth comedic brilliance. Especially when you add a cigar.

Wockenfuss · Guru

Wockenfuss · Guru

pocaroba · Guru

Nice work, dude. I look forward to purchasing that at a later date. How sketchy is the description of the XXX version? It is German sans English subtitles. I appreciate that apparently "softcore" has never flown in Germany.

That website looks very dangerous for my pocketbook. It is like a who's who of crappy films. Damn the internet. It is constantly separating me from money.

Wockenfuss · Guru

Alright, a found a site that has the Italian Stallion 2 disc.

Looks like it doesn't have anything new. But, it's cheap enough to look good in the collection...

pocaroba · Guru

First of all, you have to love the Angry Nintendo Nerd. Second of all, if there is an "Italian Stallion" 2-disc DVD, I must have it. What could they possibly put on the 2nd disc? Honestly. Where did you find that picture?

Wockenfuss · Guru

Italian Stallion 2-Disc?

Wockenfuss · Guru

Wockenfuss · Guru

Wasn't the guy in VI a real boxer?

The huge mistake he made in V was just not getting in the ring. A street fight (and a fairly short one at that) just doesn't satisfy after the huge fights in the first four.

But all in all, not as bad as I remember it. The scene where Rocky is watching Tommy Gunn fight on TV in his basement and he's beating the heavy bag along with the fight is pretty cool. And the kid from Entourage wailing on Rocky Jr. is pretty funny.

pocaroba · Guru

"You're nyead" is one of my fave lines. Thing about V that kills me is that it could be so much better. The idea/concept is there, the execution is not. Part of that blame can lay on 1990 but II was made at the height of disco and still remains the best of the sextology.

I agree Wock, Lundgren makes IV. Without him who knows just how good it would really be. The same goes for Mr. T. He is so good in III it really makes the film. I think that Stallone opting for actual boxers over actors for V and VI is kind of a bad call. They aren't really that entertaining or threatening.

The guy that plays Duke in V really makes you hate him though. And at least Stallone never killed Tony or Paulie. That I can not forgive.

angie · Veteran Member

mock IV all you want. but in my world, sweet lines like "i must break you", and "finish him" uttered without laughing aren't just for porno. and the pure genious of the '80's musical montage can never be overdone. ever.

Wockenfuss · Guru

V was way more tolerable than I remember it. The thing is, on paper I bet that movie looked pretty good. Tommy Morrison just couldn't pull it off. And, looking back, pretty much everything in 1990 sucked. It was that year before Nirvana, when Corey Feldman was dressing like Michael Jackson and Snap! had a hit single with "The Power." Sad times.

The best part of V:

George W. Duke: "In the ring, in the ring. Tommy Gunn only fights in the ring."

Rocky: "My ring's outside."

Corny as hell, but somehow kind of badass.

If anyone else had played Drago in IV, that movie may not have been worth watching. Lundgren is so good in that movie (it helps that he has like 6 lines) at being a stone cold punching machine that he makes the film. Same thing with T in III. He's actually frightening. And his name is Clubber, which is pretty tight.

Seems like before V, the timeline gets a little screwy in places (I think they fudge Rocky's age to make him a few years younger in III) but when he comes back from Russia and the kid's grown two feet, it's a little ridiculous. Of course, so is the fact that Rocky took down a guy half his age, twice his size, who was more juiced than Jay Kordich. So I'll look the other way.

I have a hard time putting them in order. III is almost my favorite one. Clubber is so fantastic and when Mickey dies, well, that's a pretty big moment. And that's when he hooks up with Tony, and the training montages in that one are the best out of the entire series.

I'll have to think about it.

pocaroba · Guru

Yeah, without a doubt I & II are far above the rest of the sequels. They are less action movies then they are actual movies. I am still amazed that Stallone didn't screw up Rocky II. People forget that he wasn't that terrible in the 70's. To enjoy IV you have to go into it for pure 80s action and try to forget that I-III were really pretty sweet. While Apollo's death could have probably been sad and added to the series it is done so awkwardly (and you can sense it coming) that it falls flat. What saves IV is Drago. He makes a great villain, from the lack of dialogue to his all around awesomeness. That is where my problems with V start. Tommy Gunn is a lame villain. Coming off of defeating a huge Drago in mother Russia, why would I think that Stallone could lose to some no talent hick? Also, when you watch I-IV, aside from Stallone's face surgery, they really fit together as one long movie. They do a really good job of aging everyone and maintaining the timeline (they even reference Stallone's facelift in III). Then, out of nowhere, Rocky Jr. somehow ages five years in a week. Lame. And then gets a dangly earring. Lame. Survivor and score is replaced with Hammer and C&C Music Factory. Lame. No boxing match at the end? Lame.

I will give it this: at least Stallone tried to return the Rocky franchise back to the realm of drama. He loses the money, gets brain damage, has to move back to Philly and has an idiot kid? I like what he was trying to do but for some reason it just doesn't work. He succeeded in VI where he did not in V with walking that line of drama and action.

As for VI, I think the only reason I can't rate it above III is the villain. Believe me, I loved VI. It was sad, had a great story, and was really much better than it should have been. However, I found the villain to be somewhat non-descript. He was definitely nowhere near the villainous ranks of Clubber Lang. Mr. T is so awesome in III that you really think that Rocky may lose that end fight. Okay, maybe not that far, but he is a scary, scary individual.

Thats how I sees it. It seems we pretty much agree, except for IV. Its funny because IV is Angie's favorite. What a weirdo, huh? I've always been a Rocky II man myself. It never fails to bring me to man tears.

"Aside from my kid being born, this is the greatest day, in the history of my life!"

Genius.

Jobison · Member

God I love the Bush brothers.

Believe me Eric, I have always felt that your love for the Rocky films stems from the fact that you saw them in your boyhood. Therefore, I have never judged you. It's actually very endearing.

That being said, I was surprised by how much I liked them (Rocky 1-5) when I first saw them 2 weeks ago.

IV: Killing off Apollo was sloppy story telling. In fact the last 85% of the movie felt like sloppy story telling. It had potential to be really great, but wow, as soon as they kill Apollo it just slips into a downward spiral.

V: I gotta say, I didn't think it was as bad as you say it is. I mean I was expecting to vomit half way through the movie. And really, all I did was burp a couple times. But I'm not sure if that was because of Sage's dangly earring or the bag of Doritos I was eating.

Jobison sees it this way (after seeing each movie only once):

1. Rocky II
2. Rocky
3. Rocky VI
4. Rocky III
5. Rocky V
6. Rocky IV

I believe there is no denying that Rocky and Rocky II are far superior to their progeny.

pocaroba · Guru

Here we go. I am so glad that you guys recently watched these. You guys had to start this while I was ill...

Yes, Rocky IV is probably known for being the 80s film to contain the most musical montages in film history. I dare anyone to find more full on montages. There is an opening fight montage, the Robert Tepper "No Easy Way Out" montage that Wock posted, at least three training montages, and then of course the wonderful end fight montage. The movie at times feels like a really intense Survivor epic music video. That being said, what is so wrong with a montage? Yes, the drama from the first 2 (arguably the third) films is all but gone here. Rocky IV is more Cobra than Rocky.

Jobison, I think if I saw this film for the first time today, I may agree with you in saying that it is not that great. It is quite empty and comes as kind of a shock coming off of the first three films, which have actual substance to them. However, when I was a young lad, I couldn't get enough of it. I don't know what that says about me, but this movie felt very new and action packed back in 1985. I have probably seen Rocky IV more than any other Rocky simply because I taped it off TV as a child, but it is so fast paced that it never gets old. So I think I see it in that "movie I love from my boyhood" light, which probably isn't seeing it clearly. And, have you seen V? IV is at least entertainingly bad. V is just straight up bad. And it doesn't have Brigitte.

I whole-heartedly agree with you regarding the matter of the death of Apollo Creed. Even in my youth I thought this was a poorly thought out catalyst for the film. Couldn't he have just maimed Apollo or something like that? Or maybe maim Tony the trainer? Mickey's death in III is such a shock and is so sad. Apollo's death just makes this feel like a Kung Fu revenge film.

Rocky IV also suffers from Sly's poor direction. I mean, really watch that Apollo/Drago fight. There are so many flubs it is incredible. Apollo's gloves come off and on, Rocky's towel moves from shot to shot, and Apollo's death punch apparently comes from both sides. Really the whole movie has more mess ups then I have ever seen in a big budget film. I'm surprised there isn't a boom mike anywhere.

What is great about IV is that it has Brigitte, Drago makes a great villain (nothing can beat Clubber Lang), it is non-stop action, Stallone grows a beard, the whole film is unintentionally hilarious (that end speech is incredible), the fight scene is by far the best of the Rockys, and who can forget that glorious soundtrack. Survivor? Oh yeah. Don't hate the montage, hate the director/writer.

But yeah, it's probably the 4th or 5th best out of the six films. I haven't figured out where to place Rocky VI yet. I sees it this way:

1. Rocky II
2. Rocky
3. Rocky III
4. Rocky IV
5. Rocky VI
6. Rocky V

Discuss.

Jobison · Member

I liked this Rocky least out of all of them. Killing off Apollo early on soured the rest of the movie for me.

-- Edited by Jobison at 17:36, 2007-07-27

Wockenfuss · Guru

But let me also say that I really like this movie.

And there are sweet fights before and after the montages.

Wockenfuss · Guru

The scene where Rocky gets pissed and goes for a drive in his Lambo is such a time filler it's unreal.

Tell me where I'm wrong.